Gahhh - pooch problems!

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FurstPlaceMiniatures

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I have a 1 yr old coonhoundXrott mix. GREAT dog - and has made A LOT of strides. Only had him 3 mos now, and before that he was never really in a house or socialized. My last dog I did agility, rallyo, and got therapy certified and ran a reading program with with special needs kids. I can train a dog!

Anyway, he got sick monday morning (diarrhea ALL over inside his crate....) while I was at work. Came home from lunch, cleaned him and the giganto stinky gross mess in my bedroom (on the NEW carpet) up, and moved him in his kennel to the garage (attached to the house) for the day where its noticeably cooler. Diarrhea stopped by tuesday morning - but he is NOTICEABLY more comfortable out there (a good 20 degrees cooler with the cool concrete floor) so I decided to have that be his new 'space.'

All was well the first few days and nights (kenneled at night), but yesterday morning he had peed all over the inside of his kennel! He goes out at about 11 pm, then out again at 6 am, and by 6 am he had very freshly soiled all over the kennel. Did the same thing this morning!

Had the vet come look at him about an hour ago, he said to treat him with penicillin ***just in case*** its a UTI - but he doesn't think so. He doesn't show any other symptoms. He thinks Roos is just peeved he's out there. And he won't soil the kennel during the day.

I live alone with just him and a rabbit. When I am home he gets a ton of attention - and when I come home for lunch I throw the ball for him a good half hour, and usually again after work too. He is loose in the house with me whenever I am home, until I go to bed. No other accidents then either. He is house broke.

Any ideas?
 

Performancemini

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That would be my first guess too. My son's Cattle dog went through it almost like that when he first came here. Check for some exellent books on seperation anxiety and talk with a GOOD dog trainer.
 

Riverrose28

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Dogs don't usually soil where they sleep or have to spend alot of time, like in their kennel, I think it may be something medical since the stool was loose, just don't know what it could be.
 

shorthorsemom

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Is he still wearing the "bark collar"? just curious. If he is barking and howling when you leave due to separation issues and the collar is correcting him, could be why he is starting to soil and pee when you are gone depending on what type of collar you are using.

If he isn't still using the collar, then that is good, bark collars have their place in certain circumstances, but sometimes depends on the dog..

I would rule out all medical items first. I am surprised by a vet that would treat a UTI on symptoms and peeing rather than run a urinalysis to be sure.

There are different things medically that can cause diarrhea, for example.....if he has drank out of a puddle for example, they can get something similar to going to Mexico and drinking the water and this is treated with a drug called Flagyl and will help with the diarrhea tremendously. If he has nervous colitis that is something different all together.

Dogs rarely get "peeved", they do however get stressed for separation from their pack and many dogs simply do not enjoy being alone in their own space for long periods of time. On your earlier string I do think you hit the nail on the head by describing your dog as anxious. It is a better description than peeved in my opinion. Sounds like you do understand him.

If you could at all set up some sort of camera and film him when you leave, you just might get your answer as to what is triggering his loss of house training when you leave. If he doesn't soil for long periods of time while you are home, it probably isn't medical, however it is always best to rule out medical reasons first.

In addition to training modifications, there are excellent fairly inexpensive medications out there for dogs that can help calm his brain waves until he fully understands that humans leave and they come back.

One medication that I used on an extreme dog (my own dog) was called Amitriptaline. Sound that out, I may not have the spelling right. It didn't make my dog a zombie, but it did take the crazy factor out of her brain by calming her brain waves until I could get the training worked out.

best wishes to you and bless you for reaching out and trying to help this dog. He needs help. I know full well how Un-fun it is to come home to clean up a poopie crate mess. I love natures miracle. It is a dog trainers friend.

good luck.

ps, add on... I did adopt an older Tibetan spaniel who was not house trained. I house trained her, and attempted to crate train her. She soiled and peed in her crate EVERY time I put her in it and stirred it into a mess. That included the crate in the car. I have been training dogs for 40 years and I could not get a handle on this anxiety. I finally had to leave her loose in the house and put up baby gates, and when she rides in the car she wears a harness and does not ride in a crate. I worked my buns off and never did get her to go into the crate without soiling and peeing and stirring it all over. Sounds a little like your boy so I am bringing it up, also to tell you that you are not alone and nobody thinks you are a bad trainer or are doing something wrong with your dog.... I too have tons of experience and this little dog made a point of telling me that she was NOT going to spend any time in a crate. go figure. I don't think she "won" over me and she was not peeved... she just communicated to me that I needed to figure out what made her tick and come up with a different idea.
 
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FurstPlaceMiniatures

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The thing is though he only has to hold it 7 hours tops at night. He does it for 5 no problem during the day, he's not desperate either when I let him out. He is being treated for a uti and dewormed just to be sure though.

My bet is also seperation anxiety. He used to do the coonhound bawl (not just cry or bark) if I would leave the house. For hours nonstop according to my neighbor. Got him a bark collar, and that nipped it in the butt hard. A lot of the issues with seperation stopped because it would stop him from going into insane-o mode. He does not cry anymore when kenneled, he just lays down and chills out.

He is a rescue. Story is he was an impulse puppy that got put out on a chain when he stopped being cute, his owner got divorced (so you know it wasn't a happy home he was raised in), moved into an apartment and kept him in a crate all the time so he obviously bawled about nonstop. Landlord said she had to get rid of him. A coworker of mine took him, and realized his house was already maxed out of animals too after about a week, And offered him to me. Some point through there he got parvovirus too supposedly. I'm the first real home with rules and structure that knows how to handle a dog.
 

shorthorsemom

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What kind of food is he on? Just curious.

Did you vaccinate him recently? Shots can trigger all kinds of negative behavior too, I know a dog that got ADD and separation issues following shots. .

He had a tough life before you. He has to get over the hump of learning to trust his human. His humans broke his trust in his past. You will find his mind in there, it will just take time. I do know obedience training can help find the mind and eliminate stress and build trust.

I know what bawl you are talking about. I rescued a basset hound somebody dumped here on my farm. He had quite the bark and bawl and I can't imagine him living with neighbors close enough to hear.

I would try rescue remedy and watch what you feed him. Natural food without a lot of fillers and dye is a good start. If the rescue remedy doesn't work then I would ask the vet if you can try some anxiety medications for him. This can be temporary, so don't look at it as a drug for life. I had best luck with that medication I mentioned above on my extreme dogs. For my Tibetan spaniel, rescue remedy worked well. There are other holistic choices that may work well, this is the only one I have personal luck with.

Watch that the penicillin doesn't give him diarrhea, you might want to add a probiotic to his food. If he lived outside, you might want to test him for lyme.

stay strong. .I am writing fast here trying to give you as many ideas to choose from as I can think of... I am not being critical of you, so please do not think that of anything I write. Anybody that rescues dogs and works to help rehabilitate those critters that are in dire need of understanding and training... those folks have a special place in this world... hugs.
 
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FurstPlaceMiniatures

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Shorthorsemom - all of your answers have been wonderful! Even on the other thread I made!

He was vaccinated in March, had a booster for Lyme in April. Neg for Lyme. Been neutered since March too. No other vaccines or health issues really since then. He had a mild allergy when we cut hay (about 20 tons minimum of haylage put up 200 yards from my house) which gives him a smudge of fluid in his ears. Fixed easily with Benadryl, on bad days he gets a smidge of dexamethasone too, as per vets reccomendation.

Vet suggested tough love for a week, then to give him the usual Benadryl dose at night a few times even if his ears aren't bugging him to take some edge off. The penicillin is Intramuscular (as per vet reccomendation )so I'm not too worried about it bugging his stomach. He will get some probios though to ease his sour stomach!

He's fed blue seal dog food, not many fillers and no dye. I've heard red dye is a big issue with hounds? He gets a kong stuffed with wet food (also blue seal) once a day, usually in the afternoon sometime but never at the same time twice in a row to keep him from expecting it. I just got him another toy that squeaks AND can have food stuffed in it - he's pretty much in heaven with that darn thing lol!

Sunday he had more wet food than normal, like an lot more. I'm pretty sure that's what did the belly ache.

And yes - he's got some pipes on him! Lol! My boss is my neighbor, so that complicates things too when he bawls. He has a bigger voice than my boyfriends purebred redtick!

This dog goes with me 'out' about 2x a week, to feed store, tractor supply, boyfriends house too to socialize with his 'stepsister,' a 6 yr old redtick bitch that plays with him but does a very very good job of putting him in his place too. She's had puppies so she's fabulous at disciplining but still being a 'fun mom.'
 

FurstPlaceMiniatures

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And nope! No more bark collar - it worked as intended and truly broke the 'habit.' Hasn't worn that in eh, 6 weeks? The diarrhea cleared up so fast I think it was more of a 'too much canned food' thing.

I asked the vet about the urinalysis but he said it's not a huge deal for him to get a course of antibiotics, and that a uti is difficult to diagnose, and that he prefers to do it based on symptoms than anything else. Sometimes utis can clear up enough not to be a positive test but will still bug the dog. As someone that gets them myself I understand!

I am really considering looking hard at anxiety meds. Shorthorsemom your experience is pushing me to do it!
 
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shorthorsemom

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I bought dip sticks from amazon and check my own dogs pee. I also do a quick and dirty test for crystals too.. if problems are suspected with my testing I take pee to vet for formal testing. I used to work for a vet and worked as a vet tech.

I have seen the lyme shot react negatively on some of my dogs...bad enough that I no longer vaccinate for lyme but test yearly. I vaccinate but only do core shots and very limited. Too much canned food can totally blow out the gut. My go to Meds for diarrhea are pro pectalin oral gel I get from my vet or kaopectate for humans.

For anxiety I only used amatriptalline (spelling?) Or I used rescue remedy. I have no experience with other Meds.
 
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shorthorsemom

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Ps I always try natural remedies first and use stronger meds in extreme cases. That medicine is not without side effect but I did find that dosed very low still worked and my dog had minimal side effects. For me to dose my dog with these types of medications it is to save a life. I have a dog with a suspected brain tumor and she takes gabapentin to calm her brain. Pricy and a few side effects. Every dog is different...just like people.
 

FurstPlaceMiniatures

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Well, he hadn't peed the kennel in 2 days!!! However, I think it is because of the insane hours I've been working (19 hours on Friday...) due to the fact we lost half our help for a really dumb reason! He's been shut in and let out every 5 or so hours to potty. I think it solidified that his kennel is 'home,' or it really was a smidge of a uti and the pen-g did it's job!
 

Marsha Cassada

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When I got my dog a few years ago I got great advice from someone on here--can't remember who. It was the Party Advice. I was afraid I just had a "dirty dog" and was going to have to live with it, but tried the Party Advice and it worked great. When my dog made a mess, either in his crate or in the house, I simply cleaned it up and didn't say a word. When he went outside like a good dog, or was clean for a long time, we had a Party!

My dog is very sensitive to criticism. The Party Advice is super effective with him. He responded perfectly to positive correction, but I got no where with scolding or punishment. He was 14 months old when we got him, and we suspect he had been returned to the breeder because he would not housebreak. He was terrified of the fly swatter. We had to work backwards a little, but now he is perfect in house or crate. It only took a few weeks of the Party technique. (Thank you to whomever it was who suggested it!)

Good luck with your dog.
 

FurstPlaceMiniatures

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Still no accidents! Thinking it was maybe just a sour stomach with a touch of a uti and Roos was not happy to be in the garage. A friend suggested I super wash, bleach, and dry out in the sun the spots he soiled (along with the rest of the kennel) and ONLY feed him (off the kennel bottom) in that spot. Been doing that and I think that might have helped too.

As per the Kong, Ive really cut back on the wet food. Now, I use about a quarter of a can of wet, some dry food, a few treats, whatever is expired a day or two (and pooch friendly! such as lunch meat) in my fridge and cup of plain jane no flavor Chobani yogurt. I was just stuffing it with wet food. It's a win win, no more sour stomach for Roos and MUCH cheaper than paying $2 a can for 7-9 cans of wet food a week!
 

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