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Blue Eyes and Color genetics

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CHgirl

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People were very kind in helping me indentify that my pinto mare with one blue eye was a tovero, and I have read that the blue eyes normally occur in certain pinto coat patterns, not usually in tobianos. Next question is -- I have a filly who is a defninte tobiano, is out of a solid buckskin and by a champagne pinto. She is black and white but she should have dilution genes from her parents. She had blue eyes when she was born, but they changed to brown -- so strange -- like a human baby! Anybody ever seen that -- and I wonder if she will have a tendency to produce blue eyes? Her dam's eyes are dark, not sure about sire's. Thanks for any thoughts.
 

REO

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Yes I've seen over the years some are born with blue eyes (usually darker blue) that turn brown.
 

Double T

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People were very kind in helping me indentify that my pinto mare with one blue eye was a tovero, and I have read that the blue eyes normally occur in certain pinto coat patterns, not usually in tobianos. Next question is -- I have a filly who is a defninte tobiano, is out of a solid buckskin and by a champagne pinto. She is black and white but she should have dilution genes from her parents. She had blue eyes when she was born, but they changed to brown -- so strange -- like a human baby! Anybody ever seen that -- and I wonder if she will have a tendency to produce blue eyes? Her dam's eyes are dark, not sure about sire's. Thanks for any thoughts.
More than likely, if she had blue eyes at birth that went to an amber brownish (esp if one of her parents was a champagne), she's a champagne. It's a Champagne trait. All have to be born with blue eyes, that as they age, change to amber or green. only time they wouldn't do that to my knowledge, is if a pinto gene took over and made the eye blue, or like the filly in my avatar, who is a triple dilute and carries a champagne and two cream genes. Her's probably won't ever change.
 

rabbitsfizz

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I'm afraid there is no reason why she should carry any dilution at all. The blue eyes turning brown is really quite common and we most of us have a story about it! I would have her tested if I were you.

I don't believe in Toveros, btw, I think it is a bit silly as a term as it does not actually mean anything- a bit like overo....
 

Minimor

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I agree--I have had several foals born with blue eyes--they then turned dark...and none of them are horses that have any dilution gene.
 
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CHgirl

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More than likely, if she had blue eyes at birth that went to an amber brownish (esp if one of her parents was a champagne), she's a champagne. It's a Champagne trait. All have to be born with blue eyes, that as they age, change to amber or green. only time they wouldn't do that to my knowledge, is if a pinto gene took over and made the eye blue, or like the filly in my avatar, who is a triple dilute and carries a champagne and two cream genes. Her's probably won't ever change.
Teresa, but could a champagne appear black and white? Her eyes are really dark, not amber, but I didn't even realize they were blue until I was looking at pix of her as a baby. They were definitely blue, but darker.
 

Kelsey

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We've had dark blue eyes turn brown. That's pretty common but cream eyes are also born a lighter blue and darken. They are lighter than your typical dark blue-->brown transition. Our palomino filly had eyes that were so blue we almost thought they were going to stay and then they darkened.
 

DixieGirl89

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My APHA mare was out of a sorrel tobiano mare and by a solid buckskin. I ended up getting a bay odd pattern tobiano with 1 blue eye. Neither parent's had blue eyes either, and my mare's sisters and brothers did not have blue eyes. Sometimes it's the luck of the draw I guess.
 

rabbitsfizz

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Champagne is a simple dominant- one of the parents must be Champagne for the foal to be so. Even though some are darker, no, it could not appear Black. Classic Champagne, which is Black based, is the darkest and it is still quite obviously not Black
 

Double T

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I'm afraid there is no reason why she should carry any dilution at all. The blue eyes turning brown is really quite common and we most of us have a story about it! I would have her tested if I were you.

I don't believe in Toveros, btw, I think it is a bit silly as a term as it does not actually mean anything- a bit like overo....
Yep, with one champagne parent there is a 50/50 chance, as with any gene (dilution or not), that the gene got passed on. All I meant was that IF there was a proven champagne parent, that the possibility was there. AND for a champagne to be a champagne, they HAVE to be born with blue eyes, that (unless there are multiple dilution genes present), will change to an amber or green color as the horse ages.
 

Double T

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Teresa, but could a champagne appear black and white? Her eyes are really dark, not amber, but I didn't even realize they were blue until I was looking at pix of her as a baby. They were definitely blue, but darker.
The Champagne foals I've had here, have had obvious light blue eyes, not the darker looking blues. When I read your post that she had blue eyes, I thought the light blue, sorry my mistake.
 

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