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MajorClementine

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I moved Clementine from a single jointed snaffle to a french link. I also moved Candace from the same to a butterfly french link. Clementine still acts like she's not happy with the bit... I'm wondering about trying a solid arch mouth bit on them (thankfully they are the same size). I've found a few at Iowa Valley Carriage that I'm interested in but trying to decide which one to get is driving me crazy. Mostly I'm trying to decide between a butterfly and a liverpool. Pros and Cons?
 

MajorClementine

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Maybe Clementine needs a bitless bridle, instead of investing in more bits. Have you ever used one?

I haven't. Do you have one you prefer? At this point I just want her happy and soft. She's never been that way no matter how much work we've done. She loves to go and she's never been outright naughty in the cart but she just doesn't seem content. She seems to love to work we just haven't found the "sweet spot" yet.

And how to you teach them to respond to new pressure? Just lots of ground driving? I know nothing about bit-less but I'm more than willing to try. I went barefoot on my riding horses 7 years ago so any time I can successfully get some "iron" off my horses I'm happy.
 

Marsha Cassada

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I have never used a bitless bridle. I had a horse at one time (Ranger) that I had thought to try him in, but he did not stay with me. Hopefully someone with experience will chime in.
 

Cayuse

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I don't have a lot of experience with them, but I did use one on a riding pony with dental problems. He loved it.
My other pony that I tried it on did not adapt to it and I only used it maybe three times on her before I decided it wasn't a safe combination.
The pony that liked it was very responsive and understood the principle of the bridle "pushing" him into a turn rather that having a conventional bit "pulling them" into a turn immediately. If I remember correctly, I think I used a bridle based on the Dr. Cook bridle that had the reins cross under the cheeks!so a left hand pull on the reins would result in a gentle push on the right side.
The one problem I remember having was the rein pressure would not release after asking for a turn, but I somehow figured out a way around that (but I can't remember the solution offhand, its been like 15 years since then!)

I think Yonies Harness rents bit less bridless out so that you can "try before you buy".
Hope that helps a little bit.
 

Marsha Cassada

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I just chatted with Iowa Carriage about bits. I was thinking of ordering something different than the french link for Midnight. When I described what Midnight is doing, the Iowa lady said she is trying to evade the tongue pressure of the bit. She recommended a butterfly arch. So I ordered one and we'll see how it works. She thought it would be better than a mullen. Another bit for my collection!
 

MindySchroder

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I just chatted with Iowa Carriage about bits. I was thinking of ordering something different than the french link for Midnight. When I described what Midnight is doing, the Iowa lady said she is trying to evade the tongue pressure of the bit. She recommended a butterfly arch. So I ordered one and we'll see how it works. She thought it would be better than a mullen. Another bit for my collection!

Be careful with the lower loop of the Butterfly. They can get that hooked on the end of the shafts. Because of that issue, and the fact that my mare and my gelding like to look back at me, I designed a bit with Bowman Bits that has the arch mouth but a baucher cheek. I love this bit as it offers the same thing the Butterfly arch mouth, without the Butterfly cheeks.

I hope she likes her new bit! It made all the difference with my miniature mare :)
 

Marsha Cassada

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The Bowman Victory was very expensive so I decided to try this one first. Thanks for heads up on the lower loop; she does like to put her head around so that might be an issue.
 

MindySchroder

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The Bowman Victory was very expensive so I decided to try this one first. Thanks for heads up on the lower loop; she does like to put her head around so that might be an issue.
I taped some electrical tape on that bottom loop to make it harder. But I swear my mare actually tried to hook that loop!

IMG_5162.jpg

The arch mouth with baucher cheek is $65 so pretty comparable in price to other bits. I paid $80 for my arch mouth Butterfly. I'll have to go look up the one you bought!
 

Cayuse

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If you really, really like the bit and the lower bit ring is a problem, someone who works in metal might be able to remove it and grind it smooth. I have heard of this being done with multi ringed bits.
 

Marsha Cassada

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If you really, really like the bit and the lower bit ring is a problem, someone who works in metal might be able to remove it and grind it smooth. I have heard of this being done with multi ringed bits.
Good idea. My husband could do that. I do think she would be prone to catch that bottom ring on something.
 

Marsha Cassada

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My new bit came. The head stall ring is too small for the check. What should I do about that?
I tried the driving bridle on her this morning and I can get it adjusted to fit her little head. So I am putting the new bit in that head stall, instead of the open one I've been using. Will try it out tomorrow morning when it's cool; too hot to work in the afternoon.
 

Cayuse

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Does she really need the overcheck? I ran into this problem myself and couldn't figure out a solution. Because I need the overcheck to show in (and because Peanut is a wicked grass diver) I had to stick with the Mullen.
The only thing that I could think of was to use a separate overcheck bit, but I am not sure that would work at all with that type of bit. And its a lot of stuff to have in their mouth.
I'm no help :(
 

Marsha Cassada

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When I was trying out the Myler, I attached the overcheck to a caveson. I wonder why bit makers don't make the ring a little larger, since checks are required in many shows?
I tried it on her today and was able to adjust the driving bridle to fit her. We ground drove just a wee bit, not really enough to see how it's going to work out. Hopefully I can take her out for a good, long ground drive in the next few days. A cooling trend is due in.
 

MajorClementine

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I've been wondering about a solid mouth piece bit for Clem. She still isn't loving this double jointed bit. I'm starting quite the collection of bits over here. Waiting to here how things go with the arch mouth bit you've got Marsha....
 

Marsha Cassada

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Today was our first extended time with the new bit. We did some obstacles in the yard then went out on the road. She was a little imp being away from Dapper Dan but we worked through it. I do believe she is responding to rein pressure better with this butterfly arch. She did get her tongue over it once at first, but I fixed it and she didn't do it any more. I can't really see that the lower ring is going to be a problem. But I don't know why the makers don't design the headstall ring a little larger to accommodate a check.
I have the bridle adjusted as small as it will go. I think it will work all right. I don't want to cut anything until I'm sure. Will have to send the throat latch off to be shortened. Why do they put the buckle on both ends of the throat latch??? First time for blinders for her and she seemed fine with them.new bit 1.jpg new bit 2.jpg new bit 3.jpg
 

Minimor

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Perhaps you could just buy a shorter throatlatch? I have one that is very short but it is brass and likely too narrow for your straps
 

Marsha Cassada

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Perhaps you could just buy a shorter throatlatch? I have one that is very short but it is brass and likely too narrow for your straps
I have a good, quick leather guy. I will send the piece to him to shorten.
Do you see anything I need to work on with her bridle? The wind is blowing here like crazy, so it was hard to get a good photo.
 

MindySchroder

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I'm glad she is liking the new bit!

I would say her brow band may be a bit too long as well as the throat latch. She must have a tiny head!
 

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