Advise please on older broodmare

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Pitter Patter

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20200608_190044_001.jpgHere is tonight's picture of Pepper, who may or may not be pregnant from either this past summer or very recent with my guy above. Anyone have any thoughts. She has had some minor edema in front of teets. Seems to have gone down today though. I think she looks pretty even on the sides here?
 

elizabeth.conder

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Here are pictures from tonight. Not lined up, haha, even I can see that 🤣 . Her vulva looks darker in person, don't know if it's my eyes or the flash. Still soft and jiggly. Looks the same to me...
I got a response from someone who had her a few years ago and apparently she goes for about 12 months, is hard to predict and got worse as she got older. I'm now going with she'll foal when she foals and I'm never going to sleep again 🤣.
View attachment 41772View attachment 41773View attachment 41774View attachment 41775
Udder is definitely looking better. They can change so fast. Do you have her on camera? My cameras saved me lol! I had a mare that’d lost her last 2 foals before I got her so I didn’t feel like I could sleep at all! But you are doing so good watching her so carefully!!!
 

elizabeth.conder

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elizabeth.conder...Here is a picture of my little stallion "Busy Man's Electric Volt" or just Volt. He has a dark line all the way down his spine that doesn't show here. View attachment 41776
He’s definitely a bay. I bet he has nd1 which is causing the dorsal. Dun will be more diluted. Interesting white pattern through!
 

Taz

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Yes, she's on camera. I'm waking up every hour to check her but it's getting hard to stay awake very long to watch when I do, really hope I don't miss anything. I know she's very experienced and knows what she's doing but I worry with her being 21.
Quiet night, no foal, sigh.
 
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Taz

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Udder is definitely looking better. They can change so fast. Do you have her on camera? My cameras saved me lol! I had a mare that’d lost her last 2 foals before I got her so I didn’t feel like I could sleep at all! But you are doing so good watching her so carefully!!!
That's right, she had a BIG colt. How's he doing? Any new pictures?

Tilly has a big hard udder this morning with some fill in her nipples. I forgot my camera as usual of course. She has a lot of hay left over from last night, she's normally a hoover, and is quiet.
 

Pitter Patter

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He’s definitely a bay. I bet he has nd1 which is causing the dorsal. Dun will be more diluted. Interesting white pattern through!
Totally naive here. What is nd1? If he has or does breed with Pepper (picture previous post just a few before this one) what color combinations do you think they might produce?
 

Taz

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Totally naive here. What is nd1? If he has or does breed with Pepper (picture previous post just a few before this one) what color combinations do you think they might produce?
You can do genetic testing on them to know what they really are and then figure out what they could have. Pull some mane or tail hair and send them in. It's about $100 each depending where you go and want. I'm thinking about doing it for fun with Izzy if she turns out to be in foal. Without that I think you could have anything but appy or any of the dilute? Plug them into the colour calculator it's lots of fun!
 

elizabeth.conder

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Totally naive here. What is nd1? If he has or does breed with Pepper (picture previous post just a few before this one) what color combinations do you think they might produce?
no problem! Nd1 is a gene that causesfalse primitives. It stands for non dun. So you can get the dorsal stripe and barring etc. but it is not technically dun. Dun is a dilution gene so if you look up a bay dun you’ll notice how much lighter colored they are. Same with a red dun or grullo (black dun).

To know what you could get if you bred your mare to your stallion you would have to know the genetic make up like Taz suggested. Your mare looks black. So you could get any of the three base colors with or without the white pattern your stallion has. Does your stallion have any white on his face? I see tobiano but not sure on other patterns. If your stallion has nd1 that can be passed down too.
 

Pitter Patter

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He does have a very tiny bit of white on his chin and either side of his mouth, kind of like a bit of a beard pattern..LOL. But very little. Isn't Tobiano black and white? That's all I've seen it referred to. I feel like I don't understand enough to use use the color calculator yet as I am unsure of the correct terms for the colors...Also is the color of the stallion a desirable one for breeding or not, what do you think? I am on the fence about gelding him. His behavior is great and he is 5 yrs old.
 

Pitter Patter

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Oh my goodness Taz! I wonder if she'll go tonight for you?!!! I guess she has to "bake" the little one just so....! I've given up on Snickers for now. She has hardly any signs other than belly and some edema. She sure is taking her time too, but isn't nearly as far as your girl!
 

Taz

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Haha, as soon as you stop watching is normally when they have them.
It would be wonderful if she'd foal tonight but anytime SOON will do 😁.
Use the colour calculator and put your guy in as Bay tobiano unknown red, your mare as solid black unknown red. That's about as good as you can guess without a genetic workup.
I have no idea how much interest you would have for your stud from people. A friend of mine looked into it a few years ago with a stud she was thinking of buying, she was told it was average for 10 mares a year and he was a good hunter stud. Remember if you want to get into it you will have the mares coming to you and you have to deal with where to keep them, insurance, health issues for anything they could bring. My friend wanted to keep the stud here and have me do the breeding, it didn't happen for the above reasons 😉. Not trying to be negative, I thought sure why not till I looked into it. I get being on the fence about gelding especially when they have a good temperament. I only decided to geld mine so he could stay with his best friend and I still might be having another foal from him anyway 🤣. There's no rush, you'll figure out what you want to do. Oh, all pinto's can be any colour with white
 
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elizabeth.conder

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He does have a very tiny bit of white on his chin and either side of his mouth, kind of like a bit of a beard pattern..LOL. But very little. Isn't Tobiano black and white? That's all I've seen it referred to. I feel like I don't understand enough to use use the color calculator yet as I am unsure of the correct terms for the colors...Also is the color of the stallion a desirable one for breeding or not, what do you think? I am on the fence about gelding him. His behavior is great and he is 5 yrs old.
tobiano is the white pattern but it can be on any color. If he white on his chin I would definitely test him for LWO before breeding to another pinto. A lot of people like white patterns. Not knowing much about him makes it hard to say.
 

elizabeth.conder

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Her udder is still big and hard tonight, holding her tail higher, everything else is the same. 🤷‍♀️ 🤞
Still no milk to test? She’s confusing for sure. She should be “due” anytime. Udder is getting closer. I’m kinda surprised there is no milk since she’s not a maiden. They sure like to drive us crazy!
 

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Still no milk to test? She’s confusing for sure. She should be “due” anytime. Udder is getting closer. I’m kinda surprised there is no milk since she’s not a maiden. They sure like to drive us crazy!
Still no milk, I keep trying.... She is definitely driving me crazy🤣. 'Due' anytime works for me 😀
 

elizabeth.conder

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Still no milk, I keep trying.... She is definitely driving me crazy🤣. 'Due' anytime works for me 😀
I wish horses had real due dates like dogs or cats. Would make the wait much easier. Here’s an interesting test you can try. When you take a picture of her udder or whatever, reach under her belly. Usually if they are within a couple days of foaling, they’ll lift their belly’s with a bit of a touch like in front of their udder. When they are super close you won’t even have to touch her belly to see it lift.
 

Pitter Patter

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Haha, as soon as you stop watching is normally when they have them.
It would be wonderful if she'd foal tonight but anytime SOON will do 😁.
Use the colour calculator and put your guy in as Bay tobiano unknown red, your mare as solid black unknown red. That's about as good as you can guess without a genetic workup.
I have no idea how much interest you would have for your stud from people. A friend of mine looked into it a few years ago with a stud she was thinking of buying, she was told it was average for 10 mates a year and he was a good hunter stud. Remember if you want to get into it you will have the mares coming to you and you have to deal with where to keep them, insurance, health issues for anything they could bring. My friend wanted to keep the stud here and have me do the breeding, it didn't happen for the above reasons 😉. Not trying to be negative, I thought sure why not till I looked into it. I get being on the fence about gelding especially when they have a good temperament. I only decided to geld mine so he could stay with his best friend and I still might be having another foal from him anyway 🤣. There's no rush, you'll figure out what you want to do.
Thanks Taz! I was just thinking of maybe keeping him intact for a little while and then eventually getting him gelded. He's sweet, and funny. Don't know about his confirmation or anything. Not doing it as a regular thing, but if anyone I knew wanted him to breed with their mare I would do that first, along with any of my own I would like to breed with him, which I'm not sure I will necessarily be doing purposefully. I'm really not looking to add to the population of minis. I see there are so many who are given up, sold at auctions, etc. If he can be used to improve any breeding stock though, that's great. If he has no desirable traits, I'd just get him gelded. They are my pets, they bring me peace (except when waiting on a foal!), fun, and love and I hope to keep them as my forever babies. Also, a question....why do the mares come to the stud? Are mares territorial with the stallions in their space? It's common in many species so I guess it would be a possibility.
 

Taz

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Thanks Taz! I was just thinking of maybe keeping him intact for a little while and then eventually getting him gelded. He's sweet, and funny. Don't know about his confirmation or anything. Not doing it as a regular thing, but if anyone I knew wanted him to breed with their mare I would do that first, along with any of my own I would like to breed with him, which I'm not sure I will necessarily be doing purposefully. I'm really not looking to add to the population of minis. I see there are so many who are given up, sold at auctions, etc. If he can be used to improve any breeding stock though, that's great. If he has no desirable traits, I'd just get him gelded. They are my pets, they bring me peace (except when waiting on a foal!), fun, and love and I hope to keep them as my forever babies. Also, a question....why do the mares come to the stud? Are mares territorial with the stallions in their space? It's common in many species so I guess it would be a possibility.
That's exactly the way I think. 😀
The mares always go to the stud, I have no idea why it's just the way it's done. As far as I know mares are not territorial at all about the boys, it's the other way around.
Even though you've given up on Snickers I'm still waiting on updates whenever you want 😉
 
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Taz

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I wish horses had real due dates like dogs or cats. Would make the wait much easier. Here’s an interesting test you can try. When you take a picture of her udder or whatever, reach under her belly. Usually if they are within a couple days of foaling, they’ll lift their belly’s with a bit of a touch like in front of their udder. When they are super close you won’t even have to touch her belly to see it lift.
I'll try it this morning, cool!

Quiet night, no baby.

Can a tobiano carry LWO? It's been bothering me and I can't find an answer. Also, do you know if a pintaloosa has equal chance of throwing pinto, appy and pintaloosa?
 
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