A question for breeders!

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jessj

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Hi everyone! I have a crazy question for all you breeders out there! What is the biggest difference in height that you have had success with (as in smaller stallion to a taller mare). This is why I ask ~ I have a mare that is AQHA/ pony cross named Ginger.She is my "heart horse". I have had her since I was twelve and she was 2yrs old. Now I am 31 and she is almost 21yrs old. She is still in excellent shape. She is my 8yr old daughter's riding mare now, and Ginger is the only one that I trust with my baby! She has foaled three times in her life. I would like to try to have one more foal from her to keep. (family friends have her first two foals. my dad has the last one and she is 8yrs old now) But...I want another one that is her size. All three time that she was bred it was to average to smallish sized quarter horses...but her babies grow up to be HUGE! So this time I am thinking about maybe a shetland? Ginger is right at 53in... how much smaller would you go in a stallion?
 
I'm no expert but if you breed smaller you will most likely get smaller. I would try to stick with a stallion closer to her size if you want want to have a foal around that size. For example if you know she produces bigger with an AQHA, then she would likely produce smaller with an ASPC. IDK if this helps but its just my opinion.
 
Generally the foals end up about half way between his height and the mare's height. That said, if your mare produces big she's probably genetically supposed to be big and something early in her life kept her from reaching her full height potential. How tall did her foals mature? I would personally use that height and the height of the stallion you want to breed her to and about the middle is where I would expect the foal to mature.

When we bred Willowlawn's Mr. Unique (43" or 10.3 hands) to a 14.2 hand Arabian mare the filly ended up right at 13 hands - 6 inches shorter than her dam and 7 inches taller than her sire.
 
I think that the cross of her first three foals is my favorite cross
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3/4 AQHA 1/4 pony. I have never seen it done the other way. It would make for a interesting cross. May you should try to found a foundation quarter horse. They are much much smaller then todays well known quarter horses.
 
I would try her with a POA or a QH pony? Something close to her size?
 
Her last foal that my dad has is 8yrs old now and she is almost 16h tall! I can't remember exactly how tall the stallion she was bred to was, but I think about 15.2h. I am only 5ft tall myself so I prefer a smaller horse. When I was a kid I spent more time with Ginger than I did with people. My daughter is that way with her now. This will be her last foal and a keeper no matter what...but I would love for it to be around her size! I am going to attach a couple of pics of her. One is her grazing and the other is her next to my boy Ferrari. He is just under 34in so you can get an idea of her size!

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Wow!! you can't even see any pony in her! I think Lewella is probally right. You might want to go a little smaller just to be sure. Breeding is funny though cuz you never know what your going to get.

Do you know what Gingers AQHA parents hight was? that may have a lot to do with the bigger foals.
 
She is little! Beautiful mare! Just my opinion but since she has produced soooo big in the past I would really expect her to produce like a 15+ hand horse when bred to a Shetland stallion. It could definitely be your ticket to getting that 13 to 14 hand one like her. Most POA's are going to be pushing 14 hands so I wouldn't go that route, same with most Quarter ponies. If she followed her history bred to a 14 hand she'd probably produce something over 15 hands.
 
Not sure how big her parents were. I met her as a yearling and my dad bought her for me for Christmas just before she turned two. He would probably know....although that was a loooong time ago! And thank you for the compliments on her. I have always thought she was a beauty....but then again I was a twelve yr old girl getting my first "big" horse the first time I saw her so it would have been love at first sight even if she would have been a nag...lol.
 
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I might be breeding my 30.5" mini stallion to a 17.6 hand tall mare...

Cant wait to see that foal...
 
I have often wondered what you would get if you crossed an average sized mare with a mini stallion. Probably have to do AI, but just out of sheer curiosity, wonder what you'd wind up with?!?
 
I would worry that the foal would be too small to reach the milk bar!!! Would be interesting to see the results though... Maybe I should just get my boy Ferrari a stool...lol!
 
I once bred a 13.3 stallion to my 17hand mare!! It involved a steep hill with the mare near the bottom with three hefty helpers leaning against her chest to give her support, and me at the top of the hill with my boy on a lunge rein. Down the hill he plunged and took a valient leap on to the mare, I arrived seconds later to shove my shoulder under his backside to boost him up and we all slid to the bottom of the hill together in spite of the hefty helpers!! It was hilarious but it got the job done and the following year they produced a gorgeous cob type filly who grew to around 15 hands. (I hasten to add that both mare and stallion had exceptional temperaments and were 'good friends' anyway, plus we always made sure beforehand that the mare was fully in season before we covered)
 
A neighbor bred her bad-tempered 16 hand mare to a Connemara stallion (via AI), hoping to get a 14.2 H or so riding horse because she is small. What she ended up with is a bad tempered filly that should mature around 16 hands or more. I know you want a foal from your heart horse, but if size is important I would suggest that you buy the size you want.
 
I know you want a foal from your heart horse, but if size is important I would suggest that you buy the size you want.
I would prefer one her size, but if I end up with a 16h horse it would be a good size for my 6ft 3in husband! (he is 15in taller than me!)

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I once bred a 13.3 stallion to my 17hand mare!! It involved a steep hill with the mare near the bottom with three hefty helpers leaning against her chest to give her support, and me at the top of the hill with my boy on a lunge rein. Down the hill he plunged and took a valient leap on to the mare, I arrived seconds later to shove my shoulder under his backside to boost him up and we all slid to the bottom of the hill together in spite of the hefty helpers!! It was hilarious but it got the job done and the following year they produced a gorgeous cob type filly who grew to around 15 hands. (I hasten to add that both mare and stallion had exceptional temperaments and were 'good friends' anyway, plus we always made sure beforehand that the mare was fully in season before we covered)
Anna you are hilarious!!! I bet that was something to see!
 
I found this one while going backwards thru forum posts, LOL, and had to answer!

I've had many hilarious and sometimes "hair raising" experiences with breeding a Shetland stallion to larger mares. We've gotten some VERY nice xbred pony foals - some have been heart ponies, some have been driving ponies for pleasure and others have been top notch competitive ponies in the H/J and CDE circuits and showing as 1/2 Arabians within AHA. Our first stallion was 45 1/4" tall (recently euthanized after 17 wonderful years in his company) and was HAND BRED to mares as large as 16.3 hh. Sorry to say that the two largest mares bred to him never produced live foals - one was later determined to be not able to carry to term due to scarred uterus and the other got in foal 3 times only to lose the foals right around the 90 day mark regardless of vet intervention (a repro vet owned her and was VERY disappointed)...
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Our own mares were never extremely large (largest was 14.3 hh), but had much larger parentage behind them... These are purebred Arabians, crossbred Arabians and grade mares. The smallest purebred to produce a foal was 13.3 hh herself and her dam wasn't much larger (but sire was 15.2, so thought we'd get a foal close to the Arab mares' size...) That particular colt is a gelding that will be 4 on Oct 17, 2012. He currently stands 12.3 hh (2" shorter than your mare). I hope that he will do what our other 1/2 Arab/Shetl did - and "jump" to about 13 +, but we've had a couple of others that just didn't make it past the 12.3 hh mark. To produce him, his dam was stood in the corner of the barn alongside the stall walls. She was hand held after she was prepared, a 6" solid ramp (pallet out of 2x6) set behind her, AJ stepped up on the ramp after he was prepared and had visited w/ her, and was given a hand. He finished, dismounted & was turned back into his pen while she was unwrapped and also turned out. That was Thanksgiving weekend 2007. Our daughter was thrilled to get "her baby" just 16 days after her 16th Bday.

Another arabian mare, 14.1 hh and very petite was also live covered using the ramp. She was very strong in season & stood quietly in the open w/ the ramp behind her, he mounted from "his" ramp, covered her, dismounted and she was vet checked in foal 30 days later. That colt got to be 14.1 hh just like his dam! A HUGE SURPRISE - as her other purebred Arabian foals have been tiny & petite like herself - different stallions.

The 14.3 hh Arab mare with larger parents behind her on both sides of her pedigree surprised us again w/ 2 fillies that were much smaller than we expected at maturity. They both matured right about 12.3 (no man's land in H/J circuits, LOL, somewhat disappointing.).

We had one "grade" mare produce 5 foals by him. 4 ended up maturing between 13 & 13.2, the last was deceased at 2 months. She was also 13.3 and we determined her to be a small gaited horse or gaited horse cross. 2 of her foals were gaited and were ridden for years by small, older adults. The other two became all around riding and driving ponies - doing quite a bit of local shows in dressage and cross country jumping. This mare, the first time - they figured it out in the pasture up in Montana before we came to NC, right after she lost her 1/2 arab colt at birth. Had to have been her foal heat (which I totally missed). The 2nd time we bred her and didn't yet have a ramp - R U ready???? She was stood in front of our stock trailer and held. He was standing in the horse trailer and LEARNED to keep his feet ON THE FLOOR while doing "his job". We were "watched over" and never had an accident or a problem - she was covered 2x this way and 30 days later was vet checked in foal... The 3rd, 4th & 5th times, we'd built breeding stocks and the mares were cross tied in them for breeding, a lowered gate was used behind them and the ramp with a 8" lip was used to keep his hind feet on the ramp while mounted (for the 14.3 arab and other larger mares, we also put 2 4x6's under the ramp to raise it).

We bred one other part arab mare (14.2 - sire and dam both larger) in front of the open stock trailer w/ similar results. That first colt matured at 13.2 hh. The filly matured at 13.1.

A 12 hh Hackney mare produced 5 fillies as like as peas in a pod EXCEPT for height. Both the 1st and last foals stayed pretty tiny at 47". The middle 3 - matured between 12.1 & 12.2 1/2". Guess that's close enough to do a study??

We've had a different experience with the last mare - a 13.1 hh arab/hackney pony cross. She produced a filly that I believe should have matured at 12. 2. Not sure she did... The owners could care less how big/small she is and I havent been able to get a measurement back on her...

Enter our 2nd stallion - a very petite, 40" boy (10 hh). He has now sired 3 full siblings from this same mare - 2 while breeding her in the stocks (he isn't as thrilled with the "set up" and hates to have a "guiding hand") and once (this years' colt) figured it out in pasture (!!). We laugh about our unplanned "fun"... NICE colt! BUT these 3 are different in type and size. The first is a 3 yr old mare that is currently 45". Her yearling full brother, a gelding since April, is now almost 46" tall and is a more "husky" pony from a much younger age. The surprise colt looks to be the same size as last years colt - they are the same size at the same age marks. I believe they will make a nice driving pair of ponies - both built & move the same, look to be the same size - time will tell. I need to go back and measure their cannons to see where we are in regards to that measurement.

AND his purebred Shetland foals seem to be staying slightly smaller - we'll see (some look to qualify for AMHR hardship registration).

Whatever you decide for your mare's new "hubby", I'd love to know what you get. I've bred older mares and had it work well.
 
What a nice little mare! I would still try a cross with a large POA or Quarter Pony that has a few generations of that size or so, behind it. I like my horses around 13 to 14.2 hands also.
 
Generally, the foal takes after the mare. I've seen lots of draft crosses, and when out of a draft mare you get a heavier, coarser horse and when draft stallions are bred to saddle mares, you just get a taller saddle horse with a bit more bone. I suspect it would be the same with a mini. You'd get a smaller saddle horse, but just a little bit so.

Same with mules... Out of a horse mare, the mule is more horse like. Out of a donkey Jenny, the mule (hinny) is more donkey like.

This is also why one should put a lot of emphasis on the quality of brood mares over stallions!
 
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