Starting an older horse

So if you follow the "Your Drive Day" thread closely you already know that I had my first ever ground driving session with Major. He's my 17yo paint gelding. He's a tiny 29" tall but packs a lot of personality into that little body.

I put the harness saddle on him and the bridle with a regular half cheek snaffle bit. He, not being used to a bit, played with it and worked his mouth quite a bit which I don't think I'm worried about at this point. We only worked for about 15 minutes while he settled in and started to relax. At first he only moved forward in short choppy "prancing" steps but did eventually smooth out a little bit. Still short strides. We just walked from one end of the pasture then gently turned around and walked back. We did this about 4 times then I called it quits because I felt like I didn't want to overwhelm him and that since he was settling in a bit it was time to reward him by stopping.

This is the first horse I've started by myself so I need some direction. I think next time I'll run the reins through the tug loops rather than the turrets on the saddle. Any other suggestions? He does know to move of to clicks and kisses from round pen work we have done. He seems very willing just unsure at this point. He was nervous but he didn't act up in any way. No kicking, rearing, bucking, or bolting. Mostly just trying to figure out what it was I wanted from him.

Thanks!

Ground driving so he can get familiar with someone behind him instead of beside him. I use the side shackles on my sulky harness instead of the terrets when starting, rather like tugs. As soon as he figures out that cues are coming from behind him, he should be fine. I watched someone having a lesson with a professional trainer last week. After the horse knew about ground driving, she got a pvc pole and held it next to the horse while they walked on halter. Then she moved it around on the horse's body. Probably they added another pole to the other side; I didn't see that part.

I drilled holes in pvc poles and ran clothesline through, then attached to the shackles. They were not tied or anything, so I could remove quickly if necessary. We drug those around for a while. With tugs, just do the pvc poles like shafts.

He is very handsome! I had a 29" powerhouse one time. The cart with two adults was not a problem for him.

Sounds like you are off to a really good start.

I do a lot of upward and downward transitions with both guys. Sometimes I lunge them before ground driving if they are feeling feisty. Just a few laps makes a difference and gets the giggles out of their system.

If he is super fussy with his mouth and it does not improve maybe he would like a Mullen mouth snaffle instead of a jointed one. Cappy messed with his jointed snaffle a lot but quieted down with the mullen mouth. I gave him a couple of months to adjust to the jointed snaffle and he just did not like it.

Cappy is my first "starter project" too!

Cayuse said:

Sounds like you are off to a really good start.

I do a lot of upward and downward transitions with both guys. Sometimes I lunge them before ground driving if they are feeling feisty. Just a few laps makes a difference and gets the giggles out of their system.

If he is super fussy with his mouth and it does not improve maybe he would like a Mullen mouth snaffle instead of a jointed one. Cappy messed with his jointed snaffle a lot but quieted down with the mullen mouth. I gave him a couple of months to adjust to the jointed snaffle and he just did not like it.

Cappy is my first "starter project" too!

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I wondered about a mullen mouth. Any movement on either rein has him responding big like I jerked the rein. I was wondering if maybe a mullen wouldn't be so "sensory overload" for him. Thanks for suggesting it. I think I'll go ahead and order one.

I tried the mullen for Rowdy, as I thought it might be better for him. But he was less responsive. The french link has worked best for mine. I would send my mullen to you, but the next horse I get might like it. One needs a nice bit collection, but one needs them all in various sizes!

I agree about using a mullen mouth bit first. If you can't get one right away you could wrap your snaffle in Sealtex, a latex wrap similar to Vetwrap but thicker. That will stop the nutcracker effect that single jointed snaffles can have. I don't use single jointed mouth pieces at all after attending a bit seminar. They showed us what happened in the mouth with single jointed bits. Ouch!

I like to wrap any bit with Sealtex at first for a horse just getting used to the bit. It won't click against their teeth when you're putting it on. It can be a little like a baby's nuk.

Putting your reins through the tugs instead of the turrets may keep him from ever learning how to spin around. Keep your hands low so the reins stay along his sides.

I think the most important thing you did in your first workout is quitting early and on a good note. Your horsey instincts are very good.

I can't get over how much your boy looks like my horse from the long lining photo.

It would take several long posts to describe all that I've done with my first driving pair. I think had documented that journey on another forum (that is no longer in existence) and had copied some of that back and forth in the blog on our website - between Jan 2010 & Sep 2012. But I lost all of that info when I tried to transfer and reset up the website with another company (and eventually ended up re-doing the site myself in WordPress). I have all the info BUT it's in computer lingo that I don't have a program to easily access it. And quote from other companies - BAD NEWS.

Long, long story somewhat short - my first pair were full sisters only one year apart in birth. Bit was born in 1991 & Bell in 1992. I purchased them from two different farms - specifically so that I could train them as a prospective pair in the fall of 2009 and got them home on September 21st, 2009 (my dream was to have a 4-up hitch of "matched" silver dapple ponies - haven't achieved that yet, LOL). I was 8 yrs younger then and didn't think anything of getting a pair of ponies to train that were in their late-teens (Bit-18/Bell-17). Started working with Bit right away as a riding pony for Vicki's step grandsons - since she'd already had saddle work. Both ponies started wearing harness, lounging/ground driving in January 2010. Both were introduced to pulling about March (not sure the date) & we were hooking up to objects in Apr/May. Had started taking lessons with a Draft horse trainer in April, had hooked Bell up to the cart at home the first time on 28 May. I no longer know when exactly we hooked Bit the first time... Just went thru her photo album and it says 2nd hitch on 3 Aug 2010, w/ both hitches done @ McArthur Farm (draft horse trainer working with since April 2010). We started ground driving Bell/Bit as a pair on June 29th (Bell also had her 10 day old filly going w/ us, too).

Bit was built stouter and more upright & traveled w/ more up/down motion. She was shown as a youngster in Classic Halter (I think) and was also, off and on, a lead line pony, in between foals. We found her to be super over-reactive. A lot of things upset her and it would always take forever working thru each new introduction of work or piece of equipment. Bell, on the other hand, was built a little longer, not quite as stout and had much lower, longer movement. She was never officially halter trained - yet had a ho-hum attitude of "O, u want me to do this? OK, I will...". Putting harness on her? No problem. Ground driving? Didn't take long and she accepted the bit, accepted pvc poles along her sides, pulled a tire, pulled a pole and OMG, was hitched while heavily pregnant. She was a lovely "hoot" to work with and SO FUN! I was jealous, but confident when our 2nd daughter wanted to be the first to drive her when she was hitched (she hadn't ridden or driven in quite some time) and I was a VERY nervous mom.

Vicki and I were doing a lot of work together - she'd come over to my place and watch me drive the two & took a few pictures. Then she'd work them. Then the next day, I'd go to her place and watch her work with her little wild mare (who hadn't been touched before we brought her back from IA - did A LOT of groundwork with her - to this day she still sometimes needs to wear a drag line, she's about half loopy!).

With ground driving, even then when I was in much better shape than now, I always started out with lounging - and there were days I pulled out my knee brace to wrap my knee (ACL replacement SX in Dec 95- had to be careful not to step wrong and make it sore). Then went to lounging with two lines. Usually I would work on one side, then the other. Which ever direction I started in, that line ran directly from the bit to my hand - NOT thru the training or harness surcingle(s). I'd always stop the pony, have them learn to stand while I worked up to her - I petted on them, spoke a bit, changed my lines, moved both in front of the pony and around from the back. The lines were never completely dropped as they were switched from side to side. When we graduated from lounging, I did lots of serpentine work where I directed them around 1/2 circles, while I walked a straight line. I did this with them each as singles and then again later as pairs - both in open bridles and later w/ the blinders.

This was also during the period I was often working babies and I took Bit out too. Spent a lot of time with her - even with 2 longer lead ropes attached to either side of her halter - and just got beside her pseudo leading, lounging, ground driving; drop behind her to drive literally a couple of steps, and then move right up to her other side and do the same thing as previous. Kept doing that until she fully accepted me at any time behind her - with and w/o blinders. Did a lot of NH type work where I sent her out away from me, asked her to stop and face me, then come back to/past me and repeat. Then did that in harness while ground driving. Up and down the short hill next to the barn & barn pasture; in/out of both sets of barn doors; down the short hill from the barn to our drive - crossing the ditch. Working in/out thru some trees. Lots of stop and go.

At one point, one hot day, she was really ugly about stopping and I was simply worn out. VERY wrong, but she suddenly acted like she was going to take off and I was stumbling & literally dropped a wrap around a fence post next to the barn with the lines... Well she did stop... & stood ... eventually. How she didn't get wrapped up in the lines or the fence (electric rope that wasn't on at the time), I have no idea. I spent some time w/ my head down between my legs sucking in air. I remember "swimming" thru the air, pony & human sweat stink mingled. Eventually we both recovered, I literally dropped the bridle/lines and harness she was wearing right at the post & we both stood in the hose spray when I rinsed her off - which was about 20' away... Think that was the first time she actually flat walked back to the pasture with me, rather than prancing (& we'd been ground driving for at least 2 months 4-5 days/week). I paid for that non-horseman like act though. Her mouth had several cuts and was pretty bruised inside & the skin peeled back/off around the edges - Epsom salt rinses and no bit work were her friend for a few days. BUT we seemed to have crossed a bridge where suddenly she understood what "WHOA/STAND" meant... AND she also suddenly was much more giving to the bit (eerrr, sorry, girl), lighter in/on the lines. I didn't feel like she was constantly trying to drag me off by the lines...

Bit was the "squeaky wheel" and she got "a lot of oil", LOL. Bell - never got that way. When we first started hooking them as a pair to the wagon, Bit wanted to "run" - doing all the pulling out in front. We had already discovered she HATED being hitched to the EZ entry cart (metal) and did great or at least OK in the wooden jog cart. We learned about the teamsters form of training the "overworking" horse in a pair with a buck-back strap. We also, of course, learned to work with encouraging Bell to "step up" w/o making Bit go faster. Then when we started to the wagon (instead of logs or other equipment), it was Bell that became the "overworking" horse - quite willing to long trot her sister's legs off and drag her in the harness if I didn't fix the issue quickly. O, those were an interesting 3 years... It was towards the end of 2012 that I had them both driving pretty reliably both single and as a pair... That was probably the equivalent of 2 solid years of driving. Driving changed drastically in 2013 - Vicki and I weren't able to go out as partners as much (she started caring for her dad in his home on the same property BUT). I also was working extra ponies and started a new job that ... tried to "kill me" (still does on occasion).

If links don't work, let me know and I'll do them a different way. To see the work done with Bit - go here and go down most of the way to start where we started her photos (all the way drops down to her 2013 colt that died in-utero 6 weeks before due) - BIT

and again, start at the bottom - BELL

and again, start at the bottom - Bell Bit shetland mare pair

Thank you for sharing! I think I'll start my next session with Clementine lunging her. I have never done this outside a round pen but you said that your inside line went from the bit to your hand and I think this will be good for her since she has started this crazy spinning thing when she thinks she wants to be done. I think that not having the line through the turret or tug loop will keep her from bending her head to her shoulder and spinning on me.

I too have had very "un-horsemen" like moments. I may have had one during her last spinning episode.... oops.....

Major is very willing but also very timid so he is going to take a more gentle touch all the way along I think. No working with him if I'm frustrated or tired. I feel like, with him, I can ruin weeks of work with losing my temper once. Clem, on the other hand, brushes it off and moves on. She has her own temper so it's no wonder.

The links worked great for me. Thank you for posting them!

I wish I could hitch Clem and Major as a team eventually BUT their height difference would make anything but a tandem impossible. He is 9" shorter than her so.... I think that he would be more confident with a teammate (Clem may too) but he needs a quiet steady teammate not someone with a sassy attitude....

9" is a huge difference. I had a hard time with a 45 hooked with a 40 inch pony - 1 drive with Bit (Pics linked below) & 2 drives with Bell (much better as they were closer in movement - though Bell found out what it was like to be "drug in harness" - as she couldn't stretch her legs long enuf to keep up with him). The difference in stride and movement, even adjusting the tongue height, was so difficult (for me). Yet, I've heard of others doing so at least for training purposes (Barry Hook for one). I drove that pair a total of 3 times - here are the pics from the one drive - AJ Drive

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Also, I can't remember if you said you had driving books and which ones?

Two that I have found invaluable are both written by/for the Draft Horse Teamster - but are LOADED with all kinds of info that I've not even seen in so many other driving books!! They are pricey, but worth it!

Training Workhorses/Training Teamsters (looks like it's out of print and only available from "used" sources - some of whom I've purchased from in the past

Work Horse Handbook - 2nd Edition

Both above written by Lynn R Miller - and he's got others out there and just released a new one that supposed to be very good.

There are other books - but these two. WOW lots of info on those pages. W lots of pics and drawings, too.