Best Easy Entry Cart Suspension/Axle/Springs

I am new to mini horses and driving but am in the process of purchasing my first driving horse. He is around 35.5/36. He is a double registered Shetland and Mini horse. We currently live in Alaska so the majority of my driving for the next few years will be on a dirt road and in fields/trails. I want to find a cart that is both comfortable and well balanced for my new horse as well as easy on my back. I have been looking at all the forums but cannot seem to find out what axle/springs/suspension gives the best ride. I have included the names of the different options as well as links to the actual carts I am considering. (I am not even sure if all of these carts are still available. I have contacted a few of these vendors and have not received a response.) Any experience/advice about these carts or types of suspensions would be greatly appreciated. I am open to either a wooden or metal easy entry or trail type cart. When we return to the lower 48 I hope to start showing in pleasure classes and would like try combined driving as well. I would like to keep the cart around $1000 if possible.

Leaf Springs

http://www.ttminihorse.com/tackstore/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=171

Elliptical Springs

http://www.nwminitack.com/cart_pleasure.html

http://www.ccfdriving.com/Mini%20Road%20Cart.htm

Suspension with shocks

http://hstrial-lbateman.homestead.com/Eazyrider/ERMini.html

http://edentackandtails.com/Carts.htm

Torsion Axle

http://www.thebuggylady.com/scotsmancart.html

Super Ride Suspension

Mini Crown from Pennsylvania (this is not the actual vendors website)

http://www.crossfieldcarriage.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8:mini-crown&catid=2:bell-crown-usa&Itemid=19

C Spring

Pequea Carriage and Harness, John Stoltzfus ph: 717-768-7016

I have the one similar from the one from Pequea. We purchased one from Pequea (through another person) and drove in it a few times. My husband who is a crafty guy and an engineer by trade build one for me with modifications to my liking. It is going on 15 years that we have the cart that he built. It is awesome, it has been life-tested and has held up well. I compete in our club pleasure CDE and have used it at pleasure breed shows. It is a metal frame that is powder coated black with the elliptical (2) springs and we have driven over small rocks, branches etc. My little mini is like a bulldozer and he likes to make his own trails sometimes and like I said the cart has held up well as for a comfy ride on the flat but cushions the back when we four wheel.

The "Super Ride" suspension on the Bellcrown is a torsion axle and IMO is the best kind of suspension you can buy. For a lighter person like me they beat any sort of spring hands-down! I don't weigh enough to get cushion out of elliptical springs or the like but have custom-ordered my torsion axles for my weight and LOVE them. Love, love, love them. They add weight but it's low on the cart and they are so worth it.

Scotsman has a questionable reputation at this time but I can personally vouch for the Bellcrown Minicrown and Aerocrown made by Carriage Machine Works and they'd be awesome for CDE and your trail drives. They are well-balanced, well-made, well-designed and come with lots of options so they can be just what you want. Unfortunately that comes with a hefty price tag too but if you can find the extra money I don't think you'll regret it.

Otherwise you might look at the G&S Trail carts. I think they have torsion axles too and they're easy entry.

Leia

I'm sorry to say that, according to their website, the G & S Trail Carts do NOT have torsion bar suspension; they are much like the Frontier in having only coil springs under each end of the seat. They also have the very 'shallow' seat, which IMO can prove to be pretty lacking in comfort when doing a drive of any distance.

Here is my own caution of 'BUYER BEWARE'. I can speak from personal experience to say that the cart brand referenced as having a "questionable reputation" is, IMO, putting it mildly. I believe that the cart itself would probably be OK...IF it were properly built, and included all necessary parts so as to be actually DRIVABLE(the one I ordered and had fully paid for was NEITHER); additionally, because a significantly LIGHTER overall weight was something I REALLY wanted, I carefully WEIGHED the one delivered to me, and,even lacking the shafts(which were missing), the 'remainder' was right in the 107 lb. range--so NOT significantly LIGHTER IN WEIGHT(as it is advertised to be)than others that are similar in style,but that are,in my experience, MUCH BETTER 'finished' and have more extensive builders' reputations and history behind them, such as the Bellcrown cited by Leia, and including such others as the Smart Cart, the UK Benningtons, the IteBte 'Missouri Flyer, and the Pequea and Country Carriages' wooden Road Carts, to name a few---yet the price is almost as much as any of these. I believe Leia is correct; the reputation-established and proven-to-be 'builder-backed' brands are WELL-worth their cost, for good reasons.

Of the commercial brands I am aware of that are currently reasonably available,if my needs were as the OP has described, I would most likely try for the Bellcrown Aerocrown. (I love the Bennington; and they have a LOVELY new model of their miniature horse cart, which is smaller and lighter weight than their 'original' one. I have one of the 'originals', and I LOVE it for my personal needs, but, like most of the others in this 'category', it weighs around 110 lbs.-IMO, and in my own personal circumstances, that weight is best for B-sized miniatures. The new Bennington model weighs only @ 78-79? lbs.(haven't been to the website recently)--and I'd LOVE to have such for my A-sized horses! The drawback is the cost of the SHIPPING, from the UK. When last I checked, it would have been MORE than the cost of the cart, and made the total cost close to $3,500---WAY beyond my means, sorry to say.)

Margo

The idea around springs is that they have to absorb motion. That is their purpose. In most cases, that means the spring has to MOVE somehow. There are LOTS of mini vehicles out there that don't do that, and basically rely on the padded seat to make the ride bearable. The coil springs are an absolute joke, as well as what I have heard described as C springs, a piece of metal bent in half or thirds shaped like a [ or a sideways U. Ultimately, your butt and hips take up more motion than those springs do. Half of an elliptical, something that looks like a sliver of a moon, also doesn't have a whole lot of give, especially in mini size.

The best ride we have found is a full elliptical leaf spring on each wheel. Here is an example here:

If you look close, there are two leaves to the spring for strength. A lot of mini vehicles that use this style of spring use a cheap imitation that is called an "ornamental" spring usually only used for furniture, like those "buggy seats" on a stand you put in your house, and on mini carts for unsuspecting customers. They are two pieces of half moon shaped metal simply bolted together on the ends. They use them because they are #1 - light, and #2 - cheap. They also are not made for horse-drawn vehicle application, and I consider them unsafe (so does our Amish wheelwright who builds carriages as well). When mini customers can get a metal Easy Entry for $450-500, and they want to "upgrade" to a $700 wooden cart, the Amish need to keep it as cheap as possible to remain competitive with each other. You have to produce what the market will bear.

The springs above that we use are bolted together, but not the same way as the cheap springs. The hardened metal is bent around and shaped, and the bolt holds the spring differently. On this spring, not only does the metal "move" some, but the joint where the bolt is takes up the majority of the motion. I should take photos when we have one apart sometime. These springs are specifically made for horse drawn vehicles. There are only two leaves on this set because it is a mini/pony vehicle (we put bigger wheels and shafts on my mini cart to show the pony until I could get my pony cart built. Remember, you use what you have until you get what you want. ). On a bigger vehicle with more weight, you use springs with more leaves.

(For those of you following the Turnout thread, the flowers were my vain attempt at tying my blue outfit to the carriage. The basket is fine, but the flowers don't work. And I should have braided his fuzzy mane, but I thought that white streak was cool.)

As far as torsion axles go, I myself have not tried a vehicle with them (we don't have anybody around here that has one that I know of, maybe when I am out west for the Oct. ADS meeting, I could try one?), but I asked my husband recently if he thought they would be better than full ellipticals, and he didn't think so. I don't remember his full reasoning (he gave me his long "engineering" answer) so I'm going to leave it at that. I do know that it was in the process of discussing big horse marathon vehicles. I think he has been on vehicles with both.

Myrna

Leia,

Thank you for your response. I really like the Bellcrown and I may end up paying the extra money and getting the torsion axle. I spoke with the guy at G&S and he was really nice and seemed very knowledgeable. He does not offer anything with a torsion axle. His trail cart has springs under the seat. Does anyone have any experience with the Trail cart from G&S? Is it comfortable?

Myrna,

Can you recommend a type of cart that has a full elliptical leaf spring?

Thanks,

Kelly

Margo,

Thank you for your response. I looked into the IteBte 'Missouri Flyer and at this time they are not currently available. The bellcrown is about $1800 which is more than I really want to spend but at this point it might be the best option.

Thanks,

Kelly

CZP1 said:

I have the one similar from the one from Pequea. We purchased one from Pequea (through another person) and drove in it a few times. My husband who is a crafty guy and an engineer by trade build one for me with modifications to my liking. It is going on 15 years that we have the cart that he built. It is awesome, it has been life-tested and has held up well. I compete in our club pleasure CDE and have used it at pleasure breed shows. It is a metal frame that is powder coated black with the elliptical (2) springs and we have driven over small rocks, branches etc. My little mini is like a bulldozer and he likes to make his own trails sometimes and like I said the cart has held up well as for a comfy ride on the flat but cushions the back when we four wheel.

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Thank you for your response.Did your husband use a cart kit or did he modify your existing cart?

Thanks,

Kelly<BR style="mso-special-character: line-break"><BR style="mso-special-character: line-break">

RhineStone said:

(For those of you following the Turnout thread, the flowers were my vain attempt at tying my blue outfit to the carriage. The basket is fine, but the flowers don't work.

And I should have braided his fuzzy mane, but I thought that white streak was cool.)

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And here I was liking the flowers!

RhineStone said:

As far as torsion axles go, I myself have not tried a vehicle with them (we don't have anybody around here that has one that I know of, maybe when I am out west for the Oct. ADS meeting, I could try one?)

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Of course you can! I have my older Minicrown which I can bring and I imagine Merridy and Wanda will be there with their Tadpoles, which have torsion axles as well. They are quite common around here as there are no pleasure driving shows and with all our dampness and mud wood carts are a pain to keep in good shape.

KellyAlaska said:

The bellcrown is about $1800 which is more than I really want to spend but at this point it might be the best option.

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I think you'd be happy with it Kelly, just be aware that shipping adds considerably to the price. It was around $500 to ship one full-assembled to the West Coast in 2009 and I can't imagine Alaska would be any cheaper. On the plus side they disassemble nicely so perhaps they could box it up for you and save you some money. The carts are definitely worth it, they are QUALITY workmanship and with marathon shafts they're about the most versatile, comfortable cart I can think of for the one horse, one driver combination. (The Pacific Smart Cart would be the best for multiple horses or different sized drivers.) If you don't need to take passengers then go with the Aerocrown- it's lighter and can be driven with removeable stirrups instead of the floorboards to save even more weight. Love that cart! The only reason I haven't traded in my Minicrown for one is because I want to use the Bellcrown for tandem in a few years and that means I have to carry a passenger.

Leia

P.S.- If you decide you're interested in a Bellcrown, send me a PM and I'll give you the number to the actual Amish shop that makes them instead of a distributor. There's a very nice man named Stephen that is a lot of help.

I would recommend the Pacific Smart Cart--pulls easily for a 36" horse, the ride is smooth, everything is so adjustable and the seat is extremely comfortable. They are pricey thouh, but IMO well worth the money if you're wanting to drive down the road and/or across country.

I have the G & S trail cart, and love it. I did have to make a seat cover of waffle material as it has a very slick seat. Were I just "driving along" it wouldn't be necessary, but I drove it in the cones and marathon, so definitely needed a bit more "stick" to my seat.

Were it a perfect world, I would have a Pacific Cart, the air ride is superior to all, but good grief, they need a reality check. $2900, to START a basic cart...then shipping...I don't think so...cannot see putting $5000 into what is actually an easy entry cart.

As for the elliptical springs, I had them on my meadowbrook, and while the ride was nice over flat territory, they had much too much sway to them for me when going over rough ground at any kind of speed.

hobbyhorse23 said:

And here I was liking the flowers!

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Having flowers is not a bad thing, just the ones I used were tacky and cheap because I used what I had laying around. I have seen some very nice displays of flowers.

Sue_C. said:

As for the elliptical springs, I had them on my meadowbrook, and while the ride was nice over flat territory, they had much too much sway to them for me when going over rough ground at any kind of speed.

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Sounds to me like they were the wrong springs for the vehicle. Springs should not sway. My Meadowbrook rides great! The ride isn't too firm or too stiff over any ground.

Since we build our own vehicles, I don't do that much research on where to get a vehicle with good ellipticals. I just posted that for more of an educational moment and a "buyer beware".

Edited to add:

I just looked it up, and the ornamental springs are 2.5 lbs. and less that half the price of a 2-leaf seat spring.. They don't list a shipping weight for a 2-leaf full elliptical, but a half elliptic w/ 2 leaves is 7 lbs. Does that tell you how cheap they are? Considering that springs are instrumental in the ride, suspension, and support of the vehicle, sometimes safety weighs more.

If you order a vehicle, any builder worth their weight should be able to get good springs. Most Amish just order a lot of the parts from other Amish suppliers and then put the vehicle together themselves. We order "specialty" parts as well, as it isn't worth building things like wheels and shafts that require bending, but the extra cost in a "presentation" vehicle is in the finish. A quality, class winning finish takes time, which most Amish won't put into it as they don't even do that for their own vehicles and there are very few people who will pay for it. There are a few that are actually building vehicles for the "English" show carriage driver, but most are just slapping something together.

Myrna

Sue, how do you make $2600 basic into $5000? You must want every option they've got!! I'm glad we got our first one at the introductory price and our second one for only $2350 (with a few options free since we were a repeat customer) and shipping was only $150 for the 2nd cart. The first one, a year earlier, cost $100 because they didn't use the transport I had requested--the second time around they listened and it was $100 less. Anyone shipping a cart--it pays to shop around.

how do you make $2600 basic into $5000?

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It is $2900 basic. By the time I have the dash, rein rail, brush guard, second set of wheels for deeper areas, plus shipping from British Columbia to Nova Scotia, it isn't that big a stretch to say the total would be $5000. I have twice been to their (Pacific Carriage) shop in BC, and talked to them, so I am not making the numbers up.

And yes, actually, I figure if one is paying such a large amount for a simple easy entry cart, one SHOULD have all the bells and whistles. but, as I stated, I am very happy with my G & S cart...plus it is a good 25+ pounds lighter than the other.

Minimor said:

I would recommend the Pacific Smart Cart--pulls easily for a 36" horse, the ride is smooth, everything is so adjustable and the seat is extremely comfortable. They are pricey thouh, but IMO well worth the money if you're wanting to drive down the road and/or across country.

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I would love to be able to afford the Pacific Smart Cart but at this point it is out of my price range. The Mini Crown is really a stretch for me at $1795. I also have to factor in shipping cost and everything costs an arm and a leg to get up here to Alaska.

Sue_C. said:

I have the G & S trail cart, and love it. I did have to make a seat cover of waffle material as it has a very slick seat. Were I just "driving along" it wouldn't be necessary, but I drove it in the cones and marathon, so definitely needed a bit more "stick" to my seat.

Were it a perfect world, I would have a Pacific Cart, the air ride is superior to all, but good grief, they need a reality check. $2900, to START a basic cart...then shipping...I don't think so...cannot see putting $5000 into what is actually an easy entry cart.

As for the elliptical springs, I had them on my meadowbrook, and while the ride was nice over flat territory, they had much too much sway to them for me when going over rough ground at any kind of speed.

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I really liked the guy I spoke with at G & S and I am so glad to hear that you really like the trail cart. Do you think that the springs would provide a good ride on grass and less than perfect gravel/dirt roads?

Do you think that the springs would provide a good ride on grass and less than perfect gravel/dirt roads?

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I live on a dirt road and have no problem with any of my carts, and the coil springs didn't slow us down any as far as "bounce per ounce" and my green mare moved well and freely with it.

I am not saying it is a good, or rides as well, but for the $$, you CERTAINLY cannot go wrong; I have seen a lot less for more money, and the added bonus is how easy Gary is to get along with. (I did have my shafts made wider at the tugs than the norm, because with the buckle in traces, it is necessary.)

Sue_C. said:

And yes, actually, I figure if one is paying such a large amount for a simple easy entry cart, one SHOULD have all the bells and whistles.

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I don't disagree with you on the price, but to be fair the only thing "simple easy entry" about the Pacific Smart Cart is how you get in. There is a TREMENDOUS difference in quality between a pipe cart and a fully adjustable, fully customizable, top-of-the-line Presentation/CDE cart! I think it's a terrible disservice to compare the two. Would it somehow be more worth the money if it was difficult to get into? Come on....

Leia

My Country Road cart has working leaf springs and is like sitting in a Rolls Royce. Seriously, that comfy.

http://www.countrycarriagesusa.com/vehicles.html

They are great people to work with and one of the Pequea Cart brothers makes their carts.